So here's what I've been thinking...
On page36, TO talks about what stories are for, he says, "Stories are for joining the past to the future." And this got me to thinking in several directions simultaneously.
On war... if you read a bit of the introduction to Memory,War, and Trauma (http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=&id=PAXDbcO9HXMC&oi=fnd&pg=PR7&dq=war+%22episodic+memory%22+viet+nam&ots=SmQ1PO7_bX&sig=R1GnDlC9PYV78eYNq-P74EyYUCo#v=onepage&q&f=false) by N.C.Hunt, he talks about the break down of belief systems that happens when people experience traumatic events, and how this changes, even totally breaks down, identity. Storytelling, says Hunt, is a necessary part of who we are; it is not an option. He goes on to quote Gergen and Gergen, and other researchers who note that our stories fashion our identities, it is how we make meaning out of our lives, "how the self is fashioned out of our cultural resources". See p.115-6.
Given that, TO's statement makes absolute sense. Stories are like bridge of the self, linking lived experiences into an identity. The fact that we may recreate stories differently in different situations, with different people makes sense. I am in a different context where my identity is somewhat recreated when I am teaching children, when I lounge about watching reality t.v., or when I compete in a triathlon. All my stories, though, are meant to create my identity, a coherent sense of self.
What happens, though, when my beliefs, my sense of self is challenged? Breakdown. So I recreate, rebuild myself through stories, making sense of my past and present....
Now, as teachers, how does this connect? Think about the work we are doing with 1st grade and linking text to self! What about building background in 5th grade so that there is context for Hamlet? We are building schema, yet, but we are literally enacting stories of ourselves... and you, as you write your narratives... what identity are YOU creating through story?
Think about the stories in The Things They Carried... how might TO be creating his identity, re-establishing himself? And does it matter if the stories are a blend of fiction and non-fiction?
Stories are important to everyone. I believe they make you who you are. I also think that TO's statement, "Stories are for joining the past to the future." relates to my life in a big way. I have had many serious situations in my life that have made me who I am today. Remembering my past and talking about it is very important to me. I think that when you share events that have happened to you it opens up reality, and helps others to understand where you are coming from. In this book stories are all these people have. They don't have tv, internet, or familys to go to. I think it is important for them to share non-fiction and fiction stories. Also if the people in this book never told the stories of their life, we would not understand or know what went on in those days.
ReplyDeleteI love the person identified as Elroy Berdahl. I love that he remains quiet and is simply there. "And yet by his presence, his mute watchfulness, he made it real. He was the true audience. He was a witness, like God, or like the gods, who look on in absolute silence as we live our lives, as we make our choices or fail to make them."
ReplyDeleteDon't you think that it's the witnesses that keep our stories honest? There is an unspoken truth between two people. That person witnessed our greatest joy or deepest sorrow that makes up the lasting stories of our lives.
As a person and as a future teacher I have and will be witness to others' stories. I think there is something to be said for the value of being there for someone in the way that is just right for the moment.
I know TO's story would be different if Elroy Berdahl had acted differently. Perhaps he would have run off to Canada? What do you think? was it destiny for them to meet each other?
I'm grateful for the witnesses to my stories. Otherwise, I think I would change a few, hold a few back and pretend they never happened.
Did Elroy touch you like he did me? Did he inspire you to be there for others, including kids, in just the way they need? to be aware and engaged?
Story telling seems to be a very interesting topic, especially since it is one of the most ancient forms of entertainment, history, and communication. This realization hit me right after Ashley mentioned that they had no internet, tv, facebook, etc. So all they had was story telling. Up 'till the creation of the printing press that is all that humans had was story telling.
ReplyDeleteI find it extremely revealing and honest, when O'brian tells us his story, he is revealing his shame, which shows us the inner struggle that started the creation of who he was in the war, or more likely who he is about to be shaped into. the most shocking quote that i have read yet, "I was a coward. I went to war" It seems to me that his story might shape him into being, not someone who is worried about what others think, but rather one who does what he feels is best. assuming he learned from his experiences. Are stories telling who we are, or who we want to be?
I don't remember where I heard, or possibly read, this quote but, it has stuck with me for some time.
ReplyDelete"Stories only happen to those who tell them."
So simple, yet so undoubtedly true. Without the stories in our lives we are virtually meaningless in a social context. It is these stories that help us connect to the world outside of ourselves. They serve much more purpose than to simply "entertain".
I like what you said, Kary, about witnesses keeping our stories honest and having that unspoken trust between two people. Yet, as I reminisce about my own experiences, there are some (stories) that I have lived through in which no other human could possibly want to share in that experience with me. These stories are the ones, I believe, that create and shape our identities.
TO's stories are specific and special. These stories, regardless of whether they be fiction or non-fiction, serve a purpose. He is telling us these things for our benefit, to see the hell of war, and to let us experience things, firsthand, through his words. He is, in essence, teaching us, much like how we will teach future posterity through our stories and experiences.
Hmmmmm, does it matter that stories are a blend of fiction and non-fiction?
ReplyDeleteFrom a teachers standpoint this would depend on the situation, when I'm looking for the absolute truth, yes. When I'm looking for creativity and expansion in writing and story telling skills, not so much.
On a personal stance, it's a slippery slope. We need to keep a check on our exaggerations and little white lies. Yes, some serve a purpose, but some can go too far and can unravel a long life of lies. We are the ultimate creators of "How the life is fashioned", our lives.
"In war you loose your sense of the definite, hence yourself of truth itself, and therefore its safe to say that in a true war story nothing is ever absolutely true." p.82.
And such is life.
Fabricated or not, TO's stories share a piece of history that we, laypeople need to catch a glimpse of. Be it that he is re-establishing, or creating a new identity- a glimmer of the truth is there. And the new identity pulls from the past and meets the future and resides in the present.
So, as the story tellers we are and the stories we hear, we need to continue to question. As teachers we need to teach our students to do this throughout their lives. Question yourself and question the source, always keep a check.
Much of our identity and the re-establishing of ourselves come from our experiences and our interpretation of those experiences. When we have the opportunity to create or retell a story from those encounters, we find ourselves creating meaning that sometimes we never new existed.
ReplyDeleteCreating meaning from our life seems to help us discover who we are and who we will become. As TO pulls from his experiences for this novel, the essence of life in Vietnam seems to pan to the top. He states in storytelling "absolute occurrence is irrelevant" (83). The importance of his storytelling doesn't come from the actual events but the meaning he found within the experiences.
When reading the book, this concept was intangible as if it was just out of reach for my understanding. I am left wondering if this is how TO expected his readers to interpret the statement I quoted. However, I then realize that as long as I’ve created meaning for myself, that’s what is important.
I'm troubled by "absolute truth", maybe because I think it's the greatest fiction of all... :-)
ReplyDeletePersonal stories fabricated or not seem to be an important aspect of life to humans. Like Russell said story telling has been around (for what seems like forever) and cherished as a form of not only communication, but also entertainment. Knowing that stories have had entertainment value or even a moral lesson involved it’s hard to believe that there are a lot of stories that are purely facts.
ReplyDeleteAlthough stories can have fictional aspects I still find them valuable. For instance in TO’s book he talks a lot about the stories he hears from other people and how a lot of what they said may have not been all the facts, but it gets a particular point across. Even if every story TO writes himself about his experiences are a little mix of fiction and nonfiction it doesn’t take away its value. The reader is still learning.
I also totally agree with Kary A that our witnesses keep us honest. It’s a lot easier to tell a story where you can make up the details making the story twist and turn the direction you want it to. To tell the truth seems to be a more difficult task.
I think that when we tell or write stories about ourselves we are projecting of how we see ourselves. Regardless if the facts are true, the person writing the story is projecting themselves in certain way. I think will be incredibly useful as a teacher. Its important to know what students think of themselves.
So what are the facts? What counts as true?
ReplyDeleteSimilar to the pov we bring to reading stories, think about the perspective or point of view we bring to writing. Even a shared experience is going to be synthesized and expressed in different ways by different people.
Witnesses do keep us honest. A few years ago I had the opportunity to speak with my first boyfriend. The circumstances surrounding that relationship are complicated but I will say that those two years changed my life forever. After speaking with him and hearing his perspective of the past I realized a lot of things that I had either remembered wrong or changed in my mind to my own liking.
ReplyDeleteMy Father dodged the draft due to flat feet. However, even though he was not IN the war he would tell stories of that time period all the time. He lost several friends in the war and he speaks of it often. Hearing it from someone who actually lived through the time period is invaluable.
My last thought on this post relates to Hunt's statement that "...trauma changes, even totally breaks down, identity." I have experienced several major traumatic events in my life. So many in fact that sometimes I don't even believe it. Each time I go through one and come out the other side it does feel as though I am starting over not just a new life but truly as a new identity. Trauma has shaped me just as much as Jesus did when he formed me from clay.
I can't get out of my mind the thought that true war stories can't be told. No one can really express clearly enough the total event emotions and all. I'm grateful and disturbed when I read an account like this text that lets me understand just a bit more about life and death and war.
ReplyDeleteWe are creating the beginning chapter of our teaching career. How did we react when this child did that? How did we feel we contributed to teaching our students Shakespeare? We are writing it now. I am creating my identity as a teacher now. Scary! What if I don’t like the way I am as a teacher? The great part is that we can learn from it and change parts in the story. Not the story that has already been, but the story that is yet to come.
ReplyDeleteI think by writing this story it was a big release to TO. He is looking back at what he was at 21 and the dreams he had for himself, and then looking at what he actually did with himself. He decided to go to war, he fought and killed in the war and then he came home. What kind of a person is he now that he has this past to hang on to? I think writing a book about events in your life can be an eye opening experience. I think maybe he is trying to put perspective on his past, help himself and others understand what it was like. I know when I am stressing and I write stuff down it helps me feel better.
I don’t think it matters if the story is a blend of fiction and non-fiction. If he wants to remember it as a happier moment than I say go for it, or maybe he wants to guide us to experience how he felt and the real scenario wouldn’t really cover it so he beefs it up a little. Isn’t it more about getting the feeling across than the actual event? I would hope that this book is more non-fiction though.
I am a fan of personal stories. I love to tell my stories and to hear others stories as well. I feel like that is how you get to know someone is by hearing their stories and you can also tell what kind of person they are by their stories as well. On the other hand if stories are fabricated about oneself then you arent really getting to know that person, are you? I have had issues with this in the past and still now with someone who was in my life living in his fantasy world and embellishing every event to sound like a tragedy, when it was a simple wrong turn instead of a car accident (just an example). I think what TO is doing is trying to get his emotions expressed in a way that he knows how. It will always be a blend of fiction and non-fiction as each person reacts differently even with a situation even if it is the same situation. The real question is how do we tell which is the fiction and which is the non-fiction?
ReplyDeleteTO is writing this story in hindsight. I always wonder if his recollections are completely accurate of what actually happened. Facts always tend to get mixed-up after the event. I am fairly sure his stories are a little bit of fiction and non-fiction because of this. TO has recreated the stories he writes about in a way that is meaningful to him. Another soldier that was at the same event might remember something completely different, because the things he remembers are what matters. It is all about perspective, because I never see the same thing as someone else.
ReplyDeleteWhen relating this topic to myself, it is the same thing. As I write my narratives, I am learning about my inner teacher. The stories I write are about my experiences with my students. However, if my students were to write about experiences with me, their perspective would be different. What stood out as a significant detail to me might be something no body else noticed. For example, I am always nervous to meet a new group of kids, but they might not even see that I am nervous.
I think for TO, a blend of fiction and non fiction suits this instance just fine. He wrote a book for entertainment and to share experiences of what happened during this time. But with that in mind, I don't know if I like the idea of someone telling me a story of their own self that is mixed with true and falsified information. I wouldn't know who they truly are. I have to admit though, the people that I have met that mix it up (or at least I think they do), are some of the most fascinating people who are extremely entertaining. If they were writing a story to share with people as did TO, I'd like to be informed like he does being labeled fiction, but mentions true instances in the book.
ReplyDeleteI agree with everyone about the fact that even though there is a mix of fiction and non-fiction, it just adds value to the story. There are times and events which cause reflection about our own roles. At times, things may be exaggerated to justify feelings or action taken by the person in conflict.
ReplyDeleteAs teachers, it reminds me of the book we read last semester “White Teacher” and how there were times when one had to ask if something was exaggerated to justify actions and bring a peace of mind to the teacher.
I think that when the reader makes a personal connection, the more alive the story becomes to that person, it also becomes a story that the reader will remember and possibly share. As TO writes, I think a part of him is still worried about the judgment he may receive for his involvement with the events taking place in his book. So he wants to establish a strong connection to the reader, not only so they understand, but also so they will sit back, put themselves in his position and ask themselves: What would I have done in that situation? I know personally that my husband (who has served two tours totally over two years in Iraq) will not and cannot tell me about all of his experiences; there have been times when he has indicated that he is afraid that I would not be able to view him the same.
So, besides maintaining the entertainment value that our society holds so dearly, I believe that TO’s main concern is to put the reader in his place and understand what it was really like. He is painting the picture and waiting for us to join him in it.
One thing that just reminded me of our talk in class was something I learned in Psychology class a couple of years ago. (Forgive me I don’t know all the details) There was a study done were a group of people kept a journal and after a dramatic experience they wrote down what happen right after it occurred. Years later they were asked to retell the story. Many of the details and aspects of the story were changed. The interested part to me was that when they reread what they wrote they believed their story more now than the one they had written down right after the fact. They often state things like they must have wrote it down wrong.
ReplyDeletePersonally no I don't think it matters whether he is writing fiction or non-fiction. What if that's his version of what happened? Another person in that same situation but in a different view will have their own view of what happened in the same situation-kind of like going back to understanding the same text but understanding it differently. My narratives that I write is my view as a future teacher, a learner and a progressor. These stories are my own and I make them real just by telling them. The thing about stories is that we can connect in some way to a story whether it be close or distant. As far as TO and his identiy-I think he's trying to put the reader (us) in their shoes so we feel what they felt and imagine what they saw.
ReplyDeleteJill-That is a very good point that it could just be HIS version of the story. This goes back to the earlier discussion of perspective; each person in an event experiences that event differently. So, what may be fiction to one person may be complete non-fiction to another.
ReplyDeleteCommenting on the story about the girl who was smuggled in...
I was thinking about our discussion regarding this particular story and I came to the conclusion that even if it is fiction it is still very relevant to the experience. Fiction probably was a way that soldiers entertained themselves during down times or to relieve anxiety on long nights. Sort of like telling ghost stories around a campfire or women in a sewing circle. Stories bond us and entertain us and were probably a very real part of the war experience.
On page 71, TO states, "What seems to happen becomes its own happening and it has to be told that way." In this way, fiction becomes non-fiction and an integral part of any experience.
Great Post Heather! I am so glad you pulled that quote from the book. I have finished the book, and I keep thinking about O’Brien’s words at the end. I won’t go into it because others have not finished; however, he does talk about the nature of storytelling, not only people in war but people as natural story tellers. I think it would be great to revisit this question at the end of the story.
ReplyDeleteI think that when you write a story and you try to find just the right words to express your experience, or the experience you want the reader to connect too, you can start to see the experience through their eyes. The new story may not be what you originally thought it would be, but it is still your story. I believe the truth of a story comes from the reader. Sometimes we hear a story and think it is completely true (many times in this book) but then we find out that it isn’t. However, in my experience, I carry those stories in my heart and they feel real to me because I believed. The same can be said for the stories that are “actually” true, the ones I couldn’t wrap my mind around. They may be true, but in my mind they may never ring true.
Thinking to myself about becoming a future teacher, quite often the thought runs through my head, "How am I going to express myself to my students so that they truly understand who I am?" As a new teacher in these young children's lives, I must be able to portray myself in such a way so that my true identity and true personality can be collected accurately by my students. After reading through TO's many stories about the war, both fiction and non-fiction, I have been able to put together his true identity. I have been able to see almost first-hand through these stories, the experiences in the war shaped who he is today. His stories are ever-changing as he is continually re-establishing himself as time goes on. Everyone’s identity changes throughout ones lifespan as various events occur and shape the person they have most recently become. Stories have been in our lives ever since we were children--bedtime stories, stories told to us by our parents from when they were little, stories throughout school and on the news. Now, it is our generation to relive those stories and even re-create them to fit the present day and our individual lives.
ReplyDeleteStorytelling creates identities. I feel storytelling gives one the opportunity to express the past in a manner that allows them to share who they are today, based on the past. I can't imagine what being in a war would do to my own personal identity. I have had a family member come back from war and they came back a different person. My great uncle, who raised my father came back from WW2 a different man. I didn't know him before he went to war, but I trust my Dad in what he tells me he used to be like before the war. When my uncle came back from war he turned into an alcoholic because he couldn't deal with reality. He had the constant guilt of being a surviver, and having the torturous memories of the cruelty of war and the things he had witnessed. He was still a good man, but his self identity was destroyed. My uncle would never talk about the war. Everyone knew to never bring up the subject. But one summer afternoon in our backyard my uncle opened up about his war experiences. It was the first time he had ever talked to my Dad about what he had gone through during the war years. His stories were gruesome and dramatic. But I can honestly say that I'm so glad he finally opened up and shared his stories because it helped us understand why he became who he had. After experiencing the trauma of war you are never the same person. Connecting this to me wanting to be a teacher, I want to always keep in mind what my uncle once told me, "Always be kinder than necessary because you never know what someone is going through." I want to be a teacher who stays on task and doesn't get offended by students. A successful teacher needs to always be kind to students because in order to gain someone's respect you need to be understanding of where they are coming from.
ReplyDelete